Video Transcript

Hey everyone, Daniel Contreras (@dlucs_) here founder of The New Era Of Barbering. Speaker 1 (00:00):Welcome back to another customer interview today. I'm joined by a customer, the Elevated Mentorship program, Paco Silva @barberpvco . What's up,Speaker 2 (00:07):Dude. What's going on, man?Speaker 1 (00:09):Nothing much appreciate you being on here. So for me and Pocco, dude, it's been like, what's this 2018, like I've known you and like we've worked. Yeah. So we've worked in like, of course, when I had that prior program you were doing that, we're kind of talking beforehand before the, we started recording about like that, that journey and now being a customer elevated mentorship program, of course, like when you started E M uh, you were at 30 bucks now, you just had a price raise effective. Like last week you went up to 75. I definitely want to have this interview kind of go over, like, you know, your journey. We were talking a little bit before about your journey to becoming a barber, going through the many jobs. Also want to cover, like maybe just your struggles early on as a Barbra, even coming into the em program, or even like struggles you had, uh, with the last program. And then, you know, trials, tribulations, you went through price raising. I know we have a little bit of a stagnation and when you did raise prices and then just of course, like any other, anything else you want to cover this thing. So I guess the best place to start is at the beginning. So like, how'd you start cutting hair. What's been your journey like so far.Speaker 2 (01:10):So, um, when I, uh, first picked up a clipper, I was 13 years old, 13 years old. My mom actually was cutting our hair in the backyard, giving us the zero, the good old zero. And so one day she just got tired of it. She said, you know what, you'd do it. I was like, all right. You know, and at the time, I didn't know, I liked, I loved it. I just always just doing get a pass time. Because at the time I was living in a small ranch, there was really not much to do other than to either get in trouble or to keep yourself busy. So I obviously chose to keep myself busy and boy did it keep me busy. Um, when my brothers didn't w didn't, uh, want to get their haircut, I forced them, like I did ask force them. And, uh, I, I started, um, just buzzing them with zero.Speaker 2 (01:54):And then from there, um, I definitely started getting a little bit of with my it's 30 doing this. Right. You know, cause I'm sure you've, you've, uh, pick the clip before, when you started cutting hair. At first, it was a little weird. So, um, as time went on, I got better. My dad actually started trusting me, so I just started cutting his hair. And then from there I just went on from my dad to my cousins, to my uncles and et cetera. Um, it started getting really, really, uh, serious once I got into high school. That's when that's, when I felt like I started getting more and more like, alright, you know, I, I start charging, I think I started charging like $5, about $3, $3. It was three bucks. And, and, uh, I remember just getting home from school and starting cutting air from four o'clock to like nine.Speaker 2 (02:41):I don't know. It was, it was very, very like, uh, it just kept me busy the whole, the whole time. Um, obviously after high school, uh, I stopped cutting hair for up, I mean, maybe like two years, but I was like very, very like on and off. Um, I did work in the fields for maybe two years, three years, maybe it was a man. Let me tell you, man, that, that, that, that field work is it's not for the faint of heart like that, that, that would definitely show you what you're made of. Uh, I've done a bunch of blood drives. I've also done truck driving. Um, I did that and I was still getting home at the hair. Mm.Speaker 1 (03:16):So yeah, you just, you just never like you, and this was still when you were charging three bucks, even when you were a truck driving.Speaker 2 (03:22):Um, I w I actually, you know, well, when I went, when I was doing truck driving, um, I actually went up to five.Speaker 1 (03:28):We're doing five bucks doing truck driver, dude. She's as.Speaker 2 (03:32):And I was still getting what, cause at the time it was like, oh, that's just friends, you know, friends, you know, and I would get home. And it was, it just seemed like just, it just seemed like, like hanging out with my friends, you know? So I didn't care, you know? And back then, uh, back then, once I turned 18, I picked up a horrible habit of fricking smoking cigarettes. And I would, I would tell my clients will give me a pack of cigarettes and I'll, I'll cut you up.Speaker 1 (03:59):Like, wow. Yeah,Speaker 2 (04:00):Dude. And then over time I started, I started, I wasn't, you know, I don't need this habit. I want the money, like, this habit, you know? So I went up to 10 and then, uh, I stopped that habit. And then I went up to 10 and I started focusing more on just, uh, I'm improving my, my quality of, of cutting hair, obviously. And then there was this one day, man. Um, I got home from, from working in the fields from fi I think I got home across six and this day, man, it was like, it was like 112 degrees outside. And, and when I got home, there was people waiting outside for me to cut their hair. Like it was like on six. And you could just imagine in a hard garage, man, just me trying to cut up sweaty as scallops, you know, like it was, it was, it w it was not the ideal place to be cuttingSpeaker 1 (04:44):For sure. When you say field work, what do you mean specifically?Speaker 2 (04:48):Um, I did, uh, uh, how in the weeds?Speaker 1 (04:52):Um, a hundred degree weather, dude.Speaker 2 (04:56):Okay. And then, and then I did a bell peppers. I picked bell pepper, spur a season as well, all my bag all day bending over allSpeaker 1 (05:03):Day.Speaker 2 (05:04):Yeah. And then, um, what else did I do? I did tomatoes. I drove tractors and stuff, hauled the trailers and I transferred the, the, the trailers to, um, the fricking place where they sorted up the tomatoes or whatever I did. The melons melons was pretty hard to all my back all day picking the melons and throwing them into the trailer. Yeah, it was, it was tough, man. When I was still get home to cut here,Speaker 1 (05:27):I say like, why did you never just transition early on? Like, you know, you have, obviously you have like people interested, like, even though you're only charging five bucks, you, you had like people interested when you would come home to cut their hair. Like did it just never seem like a serious thing long-term do you, did, did you just think barbering wasn't like, long-term like a good situation.Speaker 2 (05:45):Well, back then barbering wasn't is what it is today. So back then Barbara was like, are you painting also just cutting hair. That's cool. You know, like, it wasn't really like a, a career choice. Right. Like I give you, my, my, my dad was like, like, well, if you're going to be cutting here, I want you to work. So, yeah.Speaker 1 (06:02):Yeah. I think, I think everybody has that, like, Matt I've heard, I mean, we were just talking about Alan Luna too. Like, um, I think I have him on a customer interview tomorrow. Um, so that'll be interesting one, but like, I think a lot of people have that same thing. Like, uh, we're parents just like shoot them down or like family, like I know Luna, his parents, even when he went up in pricing were like, why you can't do this? What, you know, like freaking out. So that was just like, you were just getting like swayed by this understanding of like, oh, it's not serious thing. You need to still work a job type of deal.Speaker 2 (06:31):Yeah. So, and then like prior to, you know, uh, working in the fields, my mom and my dad got separated. So like, that was another hard thing that I had to go through going into barbering, you know? So, um, I guess you can say like, Barbara was my escape, like a reality. Right. You know, like when I was cutting here, I wasn't thinking about nothing else. I was talking to my friends. Like it was just me and the client or my friends. Right. Um, and, uh, um, it w it was just very tough trying to explain to my parents, like, this is what I want to do, you know? And I remember getting home that day from, uh, from work and cutting until like one in the morning. I, I, my light bulb turned on, like, that's like, I was like, you know what, this is what I want to do. I'm going to school locally, locally. I freaking, you know, made it through school. Cause you know, I'm sure you went to barber school too. And it's one of those things where it's kind of, you know,Speaker 1 (07:27):I got in and out pretty quick, they were doing some sketches. So I got in out.Speaker 2 (07:32):Right. Like it's a bunch of like, they don't like, okay, Bartman school is called. You're trying to get you to buy sense. But like, it's not necessarily like, they don't teach you how to cut hair.Speaker 1 (07:40):Yeah. That's like a huge misconception because I hop on, Barbara's like, I want to join the IOM program. Like, Aw, I got to get my license first. I'm like, why dude? Like, it's like, you know, you can, I mean, I understand if you wanna get into a barbershop and like be legit, like obviously you need a license, but like, man, this is not for, this is not like all barber schools, but for the majority of them, I think they're pretty, like, they're more like, just give me the cash, we'll get you your hours. It's like, give me cash. Like you can get this piece of paper to like cut hair. It's not really there to, to teach in form. Like I said, I know there are probably some good ones out there, um, that do their due diligence at best. But like, I know for majority of them, cause you're, you're in a, where are you located again? You're in like Southern California or the bay area?Speaker 2 (08:21):Um, uh, it's it's uh, it's, it's a city close to Fresno. Okay. Okay. It's Las Vegas. So it's a 45 minutes out from Fresno.Speaker 1 (08:28):Got it. Okay. And then how, how old are you again? By the way? Right now I'm 27. Oh, we're same age. Okay. So how old were you when you were doing these jobs then? Like where are you? Like straight out of high school.Speaker 2 (08:40):Yeah. I bought a drink in high school. Um, I actually had a job working, so I w I would, I would get home, do my homework and I would go to work at around six or wouldn't go home to like fricking one in the morning and then go and go to school the next day. Um, so during the week, I don't really have time to cut hair because of work and school,Speaker 1 (08:58):Homework,Speaker 2 (08:59):The hell it was dude, it was, it was a tight squeeze squeeze, but I, I somehow made it out alive. Um, because like dealing with my parents' divorce and stuff like that, like that, I just wanted to stay busy. Like that's, that's all I wanted to do was just stay busy. I didn't want to think about nothing else. Just keeping busy. I don't care if I'm here until one in the morning. I don't care. As long as I'm busy little did I know that wasn't a affect me later on, later on. Cause like now it was like, now I have freaking backaches and. Like. You know, like, cause I know noticed for a fact from those jobs that I, that I had done before, um, I think I stopped working in those hard drives when I was 22, 22 is when I started to barber school. Okay. And then I graduated when I was 23, got my license right away. I kinda set on my first try. Um, so I was blessed enough to actually get it my first try. And then I went to a shop right after literally the next day I went to work, started building up my clientele and this little town called fireball, California. Um, that's my first where I originally firstSpeaker 1 (09:59):Started. How much were you charging?Speaker 2 (10:02):Uh, I started charging $13. Whoa.Speaker 1 (10:04):So you were still charted like what? You were charging $5 still in barber school. Was that correct? Or did you go upSpeaker 2 (10:11):A barber school? I went up to eight.Speaker 1 (10:13):Okay. So you had like a $5 increase, like after that. So you, you, you were like. Yeah, I'll do this all day.Speaker 2 (10:19):Yeah. You know the IVs also like, so being in a barbershop compared to the field work, it wasn't, it was like better for me. Like this is like the corporate job for me. Like this is like,Speaker 1 (10:30):You got AC you could, you relax and we'll do whatever you want. Yeah. Okay.Speaker 2 (10:34):I remember cause I was, I wasn't fireball for about three years and I remember just looking up and I was like, this is, this really can be good for me. Like, like, is it okay for me to want more? And then I was like, yeah, it's okay for me to want more. I want more. So that's when I decided to move to Los Banas, which is a town 30 minutes away from, from fireball. Um, luckily I live in the town in the middle of them, so I, the drive was nothing at all. It was, it was nothing. And um, I moved to, I moved to Las Bannis and again, I had to restart my whole client. So I did have people commuting for me, but it wasn't really like all crazy. So it took me a while to build up a clientele. I was at a, at a shop for, at a pet shop for about a year. Um, that's actually, when I joined the first program uh [inaudible]Speaker 1 (11:26):Uh, just not on social media, not nothing because it's so like you move, you moved to Los Banos and like, um, that's when you joined or were you there for a little bit kind of built things up or was it just like, oh, I moved here. Let me get on this social media thing right away.Speaker 2 (11:38):Uh, yeah, right away. I knew. Yeah. I knew it was a no-brainer like I S I seen your ads and then I seen, um, uh, J J barber bearded, Barbara. I don't know if you know what I'm talking about.Speaker 1 (11:50):JJ, JJ, the bigger ballroom.Speaker 2 (11:51):Yeah. Yeah. He, um, he actually was the one that persuaded me to do it. Cause I asked him about it and he said, bro, if you just pay attention and just do what he says, you'll be fine. And of course, you know, I had my harshest with the program. Like I didn't, I didn't have no direction leading up to him. You know, it was just about posting and trying to get a lot of views, followers and stuff like that. Like that, that was the brace that I thought that I had, I had to play or out or how to win. Right. You know, so leading up to E M L it was just a whole different ball game, man.Speaker 1 (12:24):Well, cause I mean, th that was on me cause like I thought, I, I seriously thought that like a lot of people like would understand that like, cool, you're going to be able to generate clients. And like also like build the business. I thought barbers would know that intuitively, but like I didn't, you know, account for, is that a lot of barbers aren't business owners at first, like even yourself, do you came from like a working, I hardworking job. So like the only, I guess paradigm or like worldly you have is like more hard work will equal more pay or longer hours more pay like that type of like trade off, instead of understanding, like, um, how to scale of business, what that requires. And like, again, when I was working with south bay, Chris, it was just like the only, only one that really got great long-term success. And I was like, oh, okay. This is like something I need to change up. And, um, all right. So you were doing that for a while. Cause I do remember you were posting things were, I do remember looking at your profile and talking to you here and there. Cause like you were, you were a customer of that pro of that course. It wasn't even a program. It was like just a hands-off course.Speaker 2 (13:24):I remember like a lot of barbers talking so much to me. Like, why don't you join that? Like that was like, w I think, I remember you making a podcast about that and it's like, like, it, it makes no sense to me why barbers don't like, like want to be like, uh, what is the word I'm looking for? Uh, criticize. Right. And in the direction where it's going to help them. Yeah. Um, I got so much like backlash from it. It was like, well, what did you spend money on that? Yeah.Speaker 1 (13:49):Yeah. I S I still get people like, like, Joe will send me like DMS from, Barbara's asking him, like, is this a scam? Like he, or like the funniest thing is that people will think like Joel or J, J FedEx people know, but I'm just like using, he's not actually part of the program. I'm just like faking it. And I'm like, dude, we talked like every single week, what are you talking? Like, he's like, dude, this is like getting out of hand. Like, cause it's just, it's just silly stuff for like even Luna or, um, who else sent me? Did you, I don't know if you sent me things, there was another, like there's barbers in the per all day. They'll send things like other barbers that see they're in the program and they'll be like, oh, is this legit? Like I heard, like, you know, is it, you know, like fake or whatever.Speaker 1 (14:27):I'm like, all right. It's just, it just comes with the territory and I've come to accept that. But I think you'll always get people like that regardless. Like, dude, like there'll be people who think like Jeff Bezos is the most evil man in the world. Right. And like he's provided so many jobs and like, you know, it's like, look, he's done the work. And like that's the reward and incentive that you're able to get if you put in the right work and if you solve problems. Right. Um, so, okay. So you were doing that posting videos, nothing was really working out. What were you charging at that point in time? Like, cause you went from how'd you go from 13 to then 30 when we started working withSpeaker 2 (15:00):So, okay. So th so when I went up to 13, uh, it was like my price rates. Cause I got my license. Right.Speaker 1 (15:09):That I know my, I got a license. I can charge more type of thing.Speaker 2 (15:12):Yeah. You know? Um, uh, and not only that, that was what the shop owner was charging. And he told me, he goes, bro, if you want one, you can charge more, but this is what I'm charging. And you know, so I pretty much, I, I followed him, I followed in his footsteps. I was like, all right, fine. I'll just charge what you're charging, because that makes sense. I'm not going to like charge more. And then it was because nobody knows me here. Yeah, sure. So, uh, I went up to 13 and then I want to say about six months later, I went up to 15, 15, yeah. 15. That didn't really do much that, that good people, I was still busy, you know, they didn't really do much. And then I want to say about a year later is when I started doing appointments. And the funny thing about, about that, the way I did it and the way I was allowed to do at the shop was the owner didn't want me to do them during the week.Speaker 2 (15:59):He wanted me to only do on weekends. So for weekends I was charging 20. And then during the week it was 15 for walk-ins. Hmm. Yeah, it was, it was very weird. Yeah. So, um, like history was nuts and let's see how the people here are going to react to this. So let's just do weekends first. And I was like, okay, well, I'm not going to, I don't know much about this, so yeah, this is, do whatever, you know, you know, so as, as my weekend started getting busier, um, I started, uh, um, I had to fight it to the mix. I started doing Fridays, Saturdays and Sundays appointments only. And during the week it was, it was a 15, soSpeaker 1 (16:38):Yeah.Speaker 2 (16:39):Yeah, dude, it was it's a, it was it's for sure. A journey, man. It was for sure a journey. So, um, and then from there, uh, I, um, I told the owner, I was like, dude, like I'm already booked up a month in advance all my weekends. Like, can I just let's just do all week and he's like, it. Just do a week then. So 20 bucks, we're an appointment every day from Tuesday to Sunday. Um, I did, I think dude, it was crazy hours. Like I would do like 12 hours, 16 hours sometimes even 18, you know? Yeah. There was one Friday where I didn't, I went in at 6:00 AM and I didn't leave that shop until like 2:00 AM Jesus. Like yeah. It was, it was crazy. And like the most I've gotten out of that day from one client was $40 at the time when I see two 20.Speaker 1 (17:24):Yeah. But that's the grind that most barbers will go and cause they going to most, most like, dude, like I w I didn't own a business before. I was just either I worked valet, which was like, and to like hustle it out, like, you know, work more hours, get like some more tips and like, that's all you can do. I mean, you came from working in the fields, truck driving, like I think to most people, like, even to us back then that was like, oh, this is the game we have to play in order to make more money. This is what we have to do. Um, all right. Well, I guess like, cause you're at 75 right now, I guess before we kind of get into your journey, like what's for right now where you're at mentally and like where you were at prior, like, um, with that like 6:00 AM to 2:00 AM mentality, what's the biggest difference that you see?Speaker 2 (18:06):So now the biggest difference that I see now is that, um, I'm, I'm able to get more sleep for sure. One thing I'm able to get more sleep. Um, I don't have to slave freaking 12 hours just to make my bills anymore. You know, like, like my mindset is more peaceful now. Like I, I meditate on the monitor daily now I'm opposed to back then. I was just so like the clients there's clients that want this, want that, like, I was just so like my mind bottled because clients were just texting me back and forth about, they didn't like this and they did, and one client was off about this and whatever you know, now, now it's like, I like now that being at 75, I make sure my clients don't have to ask me anything before they need the chair, because once they leave the chair at this point, that's all, that's all I can do for you, man. Yeah, sure. So, um, like my mindset now has for sure shifted since I joined the M like, I remember just smoking weed all the time. So like now it's just like, like, dude, like I should have done this a long time ago. Like what the hell?Speaker 1 (19:07):Yeah. You know, you and Greg, that, that was you Greg. I'm sure there's other people that were just like smoking too much weed. I'm like, dude, like you can't make good business decisions. Like once you, once you hit that, people were like, oh, I can think better. I'm like. Be sober. Try that out for like a week trying to get, I think for you too, you're just so much more clear-minded right now. Definitely.Speaker 2 (19:26):Yeah, definitely. Um, like, uh, it was for sure one of those things that I had overcome, uh, because I felt like I needed it. Right. You know? Um, I feel like I needed it when in reality you don't, it's just the thing that you put on yourself for whatever reason. Right. You know? Yeah. All right. So, and go ahead.Speaker 1 (19:43):No was good to say like, all right. So you were 30 bucks. I know, like once we got you, you joined M I think I reached out to, I think I DMD. Cause I remember like you before I know I was building this thing. I was like, you know what? He's doesn't really have that much access. Let me tap in with him. See where he's at. Well, I guess why did you choose to join the ESM program? Uh, even though you had gone through the dominant social media program prior?Speaker 2 (20:07):Uh, the reason why I joined joined DM is because I seen, uh, a lot of people, a lot of barbers that I look up to gain success from it, like JSP did it for one, like I actually look up for his work. Um, that'd be, Chris is another one. Uh, J I don't know if JJ is in the limited mentorship.Speaker 1 (20:24):I don't think he's really doing too much. Um,Speaker 2 (20:27):I mean, like I still, I still follow his work ethic as well. Um, I started noticing that these barbers just like popping off calls, like dude, like, like if it works for them, like when we would think it won't work for me, I just got to do the work. Right. You know? So, um, even though like, it was a Rocky thing with, uh, with the, with the, with the first one I knew for a, this one was way more cause obviously the price points more in, you know, and obviously the, we get more help opposed to the first one. Yeah. You know, so I knew it was a no-brainer like, I, I mean, from that call, that, that interview that we did from the first one, I knew I wanted to do it. Like it was, it wasn't no, no question. It was crazy because if I'm being honest, like I did it in the midst of a pandemic and, and these farmers don't believe me.Speaker 2 (21:10):Like when I tell them, like, I like, like if I have a few barbers that are like, like, um, they're like we have back and forth with it. Like last year I joined Brewster, I joined bro. Just do it. Like I if take it from me, bro. I did it in the mix of a pandemic. One, two, I did it with barely any cash reserves because I knew this was, this was gonna work. I knew if I did the work, there was no like going back, you know what I mean? So, um, and then here we are now I'm at 75. Um, I have, um, I have a clear image of my business now. Like, like never before, like it's, it's just crazy to me. Like I know what's going in, what's going out much. I'm making the day and where my money is going, as opposed to back then it was like, oh, well I have five people today. Just how much we're bringing in. Cool.Speaker 1 (21:51):Yeah. Hopefully tomorrow is better. Yeah. Yeah. I just remember like, thinking that as a Barbara, like only three people that well, hopefully tomorrow, but it's always that hope and pray thing. Well maybe tomorrow, maybe next week. Um, maybe it's just like, something's going on. Maybe like everybody's busy, you know, you're just kind of like you're, you're not in control of the business. That's what I think is the biggest difference. Um, from like I get into, I call it like a barber who is a charity versus a business. Like a charity is more like, ah, maybe tomorrow, maybe, you know, next week, ah, maybe people are busy. Maybe they got family events and then waiting around for like, I don't know, Memorial day to happen or some type of holiday event to be busy and make money versus like, dude just build the business to where it's like that every single week. Um, no matter what,Speaker 2 (22:32):Like I do feel like running a charity and a business is one of the hardest pills for a barber to swallow. Yeah. In my opinion. Yeah. Because, because around my area, a lot of barbers are like a couple of my friends, my friends, my friends, I can't do it to my friends bro. My friends. And I'm like, bro, but like they have to respect that you're a business first. Like what about you? Like, you actually are taking the time to learn the craft and appreciate the craft when they're just wandering your hair. Like, I, I, I, um, I talked to one barber every day from my area and I told him my bro, but you gotta understand is that your clients come to you for one hour out of their day that that's a small fragment out of their day. Like you can't, you can't paint a picture for them and say like, oh, without me there, nothing. No like if you can't get there, they're gonna move them to the next one, bro. But that's, that's what you need. We have to understand, like you're not this like celebrity to them, you know? Like you're just one hour out of their day, you know?Speaker 1 (23:27):I think, I think it was just like, you know, cause a lot of people create relationships with, with their clients. And like, I mean I did too, but like, um, one thing that I just realized is like, dude, it's not like, you're just never gonna see them again. Like he'd always go out, hang out with them, text them, call them up real quick, see how they're doing. Like, it's not like you just, all of a sudden like ghosting them. It's just like, look, you're running your business. And like, um, man, I, I get a lot of barbers on calls where they're just like, Aw man, I don't know. Like I don't want to lose my client. I don't want to lose like that relationship. I'm like, do what your business, like go hang out with them on the weekend or something like go out, you know, schedule like a dinner.Speaker 1 (24:00):Like if, even if you're a barbershop. Cause of course I worked in a barbershop, like most of my clients that like, didn't, didn't move up with me. Like I still saw them almost every week. Cause they would be with other barbers and I would just catch up with them then. And it wasn't like a big deal. It wasn't like this bad thing. The only, the only, the only people that gave would give me problems. Even if that I don't even think I even experienced that was just like people that you don't really want in your business. Right? Like everybody has bad clients or like people who will like, not respect, like I call it bad behavior. Those are probably the only people that will do that. And it's a very few like even, and most probably won't even voice that maybe like one or two and you can't take like one or two his opinion about like the mass majority.Speaker 1 (24:40):It's like, I don't know, dude going in America and like interviewing like three people randomly off the street talking about their political views or whatever they want to do. And then thinking that's the whole, you know, us like population's mindset. Right. It's just like, it's so it's so big. And like it's, it's not even like it's a little speck, right? Don't you can't take the little drop of water for the ocean. Um, definitely for you I guess. Um, I know what was it like I think about eight weeks or so many, 10 weeks into the program. When you first joined, you went from 30, we went up to 50 and then we kind of stagnated for a while. We were talking about this before. Um, what kind of happened to you when you stagnated? Cause like of course, you joined in like July last year we went up probably like September of last year to September 9th.Speaker 2 (25:25):Oh. You actually numberSpeaker 1 (25:26):Nine. All right. So it took us, it took us a year from 50 to 75. What happened?Speaker 2 (25:32):Um, so a few things that had, uh, had to happen before for me going up to somebody five was obviously I had to tighten up some areas in my life, which definitely was a smoking weed. I definitely had to pull the plug on that. Um, I had to take a step, a few steps away from that. And then also, um, I also had to definitely see what was more important to me then. Um, uh, then, then being at 50. So for example, like the, for example, like I definitely value some since all my clientele, like I, I definitely value them, but they also knew that I was going to go up. I recently had this competition with my clients, like, yeah, I knew that you were going to be, you were going to go up. I knew that already. It was just a matter of time.Speaker 2 (26:17):And I was like, like most like some of my clients are actually knows that I'm going to go up and they keep going up, you know? So, so I had to understand that it was nothing personal one, you know, it wouldn't be personal. And, and, and, and I had to explain to a lot of people too, that this is just business. Like I had a lot of people telling me this is not going to work, blah, blah, blah. I was like, I'm not gonna work like projecting fear already, all my plans. And I'm like, like, this is one thing that I have to like, not listen to for sure. And you know, I definitely had to shut out all the negativity, cut off a few people that were just like negative, straight up negative, you know? Um, I definitely feel like I know that I'm at 75 more eyes on me now in my city because I'm the only one trying to show people like, Hey, if you're a business, first one, you know, one.Speaker 2 (27:11):And, and I feel like, like, um, a lot of Barbara's there. Like they, they, they, I can't tell you how many times I get to some ideas. Like, like I see your ad, bro. I see you on this interview, blah, blah, blah. Like, is it, is it? And like, no, it's not like you've literally got to hit, like hit them up. Like I eventually got tired of like explaining myself. That's another thing too, that I had to stop doing is explaining to myself. Yeah. You know, like it's just ridiculous. Like, like people were just like, like, how dare you? How dare you? You know,Speaker 1 (27:40):How dare Bezos make more Amazon stores? How dairy make more jobs. It's just, it's the same thing. Yeah.Speaker 2 (27:48):You know? So those are the things that I had to understand and like, and like remind myself, like, Hey, you know, like, Hey, you know what? It might be slow today, but you're working on your business while you're not cutting hair. Yeah. So that's another thing that, that, that I had going on too. I remember when I went to go to 50 and I was like, I kind of slow for like, uh, like I want to say about two weeks, I had all this time to focus on tracking. Um, obviously the Ian program, um, I'm almost done with it. Um, I had more time to work on my content to perspect that and ask questions and stuff like that. So those are the things that had to happen for me to go up with 75 and what I'm realizing now. Yeah. You know, and now that I'm at 75, I know it's going to take another, another big push because now it's, I'm going to a, another tier and I have to keep going, you know? SoSpeaker 1 (28:35):You say like a big thing that held you back once you got to 50 was like, man, cool. I'm here. Like I just got to keep doing what I'm doing. Like, it was kind of like whatever you were doing at 30, you thought I could apply, play at 50 bucks and keep you going. Is that what kind of held you back at first toSpeaker 2 (28:48):Definitely because when I was at $30, another $30, I was like, I was like, oh, well, tomorrow might be better, you know? Yeah.Speaker 1 (28:56):Cause it sounded like you have the same habits, like smoking weed. And I try to be very vocal about this. And when you go up, like you change the whole business and you need to step the up, like with your whole business, like with how you structure things, how you track things and need to spot the problems head on right then and there to ensure that you can like, cause most people they'll go up and they'll be like, oh, I know it's going to be slow. And they just kind of wait until it like builds back out again. You kind of have to be very proactive. Like you can't just sit back and do the same thing. Cause like, you know, you kind of did that for one, like it took you over a year to then be in a position to be able to 75 to, I know we were talking about before was like, um, man, like I think you talked that you think you said like pride or ego got in your way. Cause you would cause you actually stopped hopping on QA calls. You stopped like reaching out and getting help. It was more of, um, w what was going on for you? Cause I honestly don't know. It was just more of like a private thing.Speaker 2 (29:46):It was a more of a pride and ego thing too, where like, I felt like I didn't want to ask too many questions to get the same answers back. You know what I'm saying? Like, I didn't want to ask the same questions and like maybe I told myself if I just study certain people and like still like ask certain questions, you know, I can somewhat get ahead, but that, that didn't work either. So I definitely had to put my pride and ego to the side and I was like, you know what, maybe let's hop back on and like settle in. Cause I, cause since, since I joined, I haven't, I have not missed a day of posting. Yeah. I have not missed a day.Speaker 1 (30:18):'cause I think it was, it was like, I do remember. Cause I mean, sometimes we still get in redundancy of like, you know, it's the same issues. I do remember it was the same issues that popped up and you wouldn't fix them. And the reason why you kept on asking questions like, well, this, this isn't working, what do I need to do for this? And like, did he still have to fix this first, like fix this first? And then we could like move on to everything else. It was like a domino effect. And it w I guess for you was, I mean, I know you're talking about smoking weed with smoking weed, a big factor of like, not handling the first thing and being too jittery and being all over the place or what, why didn't you just fix the things first?Speaker 2 (30:51):Um, honestly, I don't know. It was just one of those things where like, if, if I wanted to do it, I had to do it myself. But then I sat back and I was like, dude, like, people are telling you this for a reason. They're not telling you this to be a or whatever, you know, they're telling you this because they want to see you succeed. Like quit it. We're being such a. The one that's doing this work going, you know? Yeah. I think, um, yeah,Speaker 1 (31:14):I was gonna say, I think that's what holds a lot of barbers back. Like not getting help because they think they can do it or like, oh, no. Like what, for whatever reason, they'll just have like a very big pride and ego thing. I think I saw like Chris Bossio posts something about this, like one time about like, you know, I mean, I, I try to not say this, like, because I don't want to seem like, you know, like people have programs, they'll be like, oh, you need you, you should be more open to getting a mentor. And they, they run a program. So, so it sounds kind of like to marketers, should I try to stray away from that? But like I remember bossy was saying like, you know, the Barbara Barbara industry needs to kind of like drop the ego a little bit and like, understand that they there's a reason why they're at the position they're at, because they can't, they don't know what to do and they need to get help from somebody who knows how to do it. Um, I, I think that was like right on the head. I mean, um, again, I probably won't be too vocal about that cause like, I just don't like seeing people do that personally. So, um, like, um, but likeSpeaker 2 (32:08):I agree with you a hundred percent. Cause like, you know, I do feel like a lot of barbers think there's of think of barbering, uh, uh, of this, of this thing that we do is cutting hair. I feel like they think of it as like this rockstar lifestyle where like, they think they're going to get on stage and cut hair for the millions of people when it's not like that at all. Like they, they, they have, they had a whole game messed up when it's actually a business. Like if you, I I've recently learned. And I, it took me a while, but I recently learned that if I just treat it from what it is, I'll get more back than if I, well, what it's not. Yeah.Speaker 1 (32:42):I just remember, I think, I think everybody has an outlook at first. Cause I used to have that outlook. Oh man, cut on stage. I want to have people watching me and then like, and then like, I go to a show and there's people doing it and there's like two OGs that are like watching some person just cut hair randomly off to the side. And they're both talking about that behind his back. I'm just like, oh, this is stupid. Right? Like it's just like, it's, it's not like what? I don't know. I never, I never, like once I remember seeing that, I'm like, oh, this is like, it's just the perception versus the reality that the perception is like, man, I don't really know what the perception is like, oh man, they're going to love my face. And then like the reality is like, nobody gives a, like, you know, like focus on your business.Speaker 1 (33:19):Yeah. Focus on your business. Like focus on you, focus on like your future again too. Like, um, I think Barbara should just be a stepping stone to the next thing. Like you have a pocket of time, don't be a Barbara forever. Take this to the max level, increase cash flow, increase capital, save money, be good with business, learn how to scale something properly before you move on to the next thing. That way you have these principles to take in the next thing that will like, then you could like really expedite your growth in that thing.Speaker 2 (33:44):I agree. Um, I actually, uh, prior to this interview, I, I, um, I re I really watched Greg's interview and I caught something from the interview where he was like, I want to cut hair forever. Buried me with my Clippers. Like I, it's just funny because like, that's the same mentality I had. I wanted to cut hair until I was like 60 or 70 years old, but I'm like, no, I'm not now I want to retire by age 35, you know? And like do something else, maybe, you know, I don't know, have another business of something of some sorts, you know? Like, like it's just crazy how joining, when I joined the M my mindset just completely shifted. Like it took, it took me a while, but, um, I made it happen. I feel like if I can do it, and a lot of brother borrowers are more than, more than capable of doing it,Speaker 1 (34:30):Because I think like the majority of like the majority of barbers, their perception of what they should do is like cut hair, build a big clientele so they can open a shop and then make money off. Barbara's off that big clientele. And it's like, dude, most barbershop owners, they probably only make like a good off the shop at best, like three to 4k. And like, unless they have multiple shops, unless they have a ton of borrowers and like do a ridiculous, like commission split and like just push their barbers to limit. And even then it's like, you got to look at bit like what that outweighs. Like that's so much, I, the last thing I want to do is manage barbers. It's like, I talk about this all the time, but I do not want to manage the barbers. I don't want to like, have to focus on like, Hey, be in the shop, cut this, and like try to track everything. And then also own like a shop in general, all the upkeep. I think that's so much complex complexity, um, versus just running your borrower business, get it for 15, 20 K a month. Be able to scale up your business, charging wise, get the right clients in so much more simple, so much more, uh, deficient. And then again too, it's you can, you can easily get out of Barbara and just by doing that, you don't need anything else. I think that's like what a lot of barbers forget or just don't know.Speaker 2 (35:35):And it's crazy because coming up, you know, as, as, um, and, and there's industry, like I thought adding, adding more to my services was going to give me more money. Yeah. When it doesn't, it doesn't, no, it doesn't work. I eventually got tired of doing all that crap and I just stopped and I stopped doing more. And when I joined the program yeah. You know, um, uh, it's just crazy how, like, I like the perception of what Barbara thinks is this industry is like to what the reality is it, like you just said, you know, it it's, it's better to, um, have a better business structure, opposed to being booked up every single day. I remember like being at the, at the, at the shop, uh, I think it was last year and I would go in probably for like five minutes a day and I'd go home. And then everyone wants to know, where are you going? And I'm like, going home, I'm going to go focus on this. Like, well, while they're, well, they wouldn't be there to like, I dunno, 12 o'clock at night. Like, yeah. I'd be gone by like five. Yeah. It's just crazy. Like, and then in with that, I feel like it caused an uproar of negativity around around me. Like, oh, he doesn't work. Like he just, he's not a barber. It's just interesting.Speaker 1 (36:43):It's just the time allocation. Like, yes. Like I, again, to, I think like cutting hair is like, you're you that's when you clean up what you've like, you know, gotten in from like what you do outside, like the real business, like how you grow the business, not when you're cutting hair, it's what you do outside of that time. And like the focal point would the needs to be improvement, the strategy, like cutting hair, just cleaning up the mess that we created from, from that it's like the repercussions of that thing. Um, and I think again, to, to be able to get up successful, you have to think long-term, do I want to take this short term money, work a lot, have zero time to build the business long-term wise and just stay here and do this thing redundantly and like the hamster wheel, or do I want to cut some things short, allocate, more time, learn how to do the right things.Speaker 1 (37:24):And then, you know, in a few months, you know, be able to scale my business up because of the time I put into this thing. Um, it's just, it's just, again, to that perception versus reality thing. Um, I guess for you, what did, what I had a point before we got on that, that one to ask about, um, well, I mean, you're at 75 now. Like what's, what's been like the biggest help. Uh, I know we talked about in terms of just the business structure, what do you found the most helpful about being in the EDM program? Of course, the community, everything like that, but just like, I mean, maybe even just a curriculum base, what's the most important thing or the thing that's most helped you out? The mostSpeaker 2 (38:00):Tracking, tracking man ever since I started tracking and knowing what my business is producing. I've been so peaceful. It's, it's, it's just great, man. Like I don't have to worry about, okay, this month I made this much. What about next one? You know, like that, that's probably the minimum. One thing that I loved about, uh, EMS tracking, obviously the community and I met some pretty dope people and I still talk to people to this day. So that's one of the things that I found very, very helpful when I felt like everybody was a heartfelt Nelnet. Yeah. Just because it saves you a headache, it saves you a huge headache, man. Like I remember being the shop and cutting up freaking 12 people a day, but the next day I might've gotten maybe eight when I wanted that instantly, you know, you know what I mean?Speaker 2 (38:44):Yeah. Um, that was probably one of the things that I, that I loved about the program was, was getting to know myself and where I was at and what w, and especially what I was doing wrong, you know, like the, I, I definitely, um, uh, knocked off a lot of huge habits. I stopped going to bed late. Um, I stopped, I stopped smoking. We obviously that's another one. Um, so I went to the gym gym more. Uh, I started to, well, I started to actually do the things that I wanted to do. I'll set up Barbara and not just cut hair all the time. You know what I mean? Cause I mean, as barbers, barbers don't know this, but they refuse to and they refuse. I honestly, they refuse to understand is that we get burnt out, you know? Absolutely. You know what I mean? We, we, we get burnt out and we just kind of hide it and push it on the rug. Like I know this is what I love to do. I'm going to keep cutting here. Okay. Yeah.Speaker 1 (39:30):It's like some self-righteous. Like, I don't know. It's like, what is that called? Um, it's like the group think thing, right? Like if you have a group of people and you put yourself in that group and their whole awareness is like this thing, even if it's like, man, some madness or just like some, some really like crazy, crazy, like, I guess, perception of what you should be doing, like working yourself to like the bone, like pushing through and like grinding it out, uh, doing three haircuts a day. Like you'll, you'll, you'll eventually like adopt that belief as well too. Cause like, you don't want to be the outsider. It's very hard for people to be outsiders and like think, think differently. I think that's like the big thing I've always tried to do is like man mass population wise, like most times the population's perception of things is like completely off. So like always try to figure out like where, what is the mass population? They're probably wrong. Let me go find the answer for myself. Right. Um, I think that's just what I try to instill in the EDM program. I look, a lot of this stuff is. Like don't listen to it. Don't succumb to it. Like, you know, this is probably the more reality of business-wise you should go toSpeaker 2 (40:32):Definitely like, um, uh, there's this book that I actually loved and I re-read it again and I don't know how many times, but actually got up in the resources from me from the IOM program. Um Psycho-Cybernetics oh, great book.Speaker 1 (40:44):Yeah.Speaker 2 (40:45):That book changed my perception of everything. Like I read it like three times, uh, not, not, not front to cover three times, but like I went back and like got a summary from it or whatever. And, and there was one thing from that book that I got that really stuck with me. If you hang around with five dummies, who's the sixth one, you know what I mean? So that's, that's one of the things that I, that I really enjoyed from the program is the resources as well. Like there's a bunch of resources that I, that I, that I looked through, like that change changes everything. Like another book that I read two recently, brother from the beginning, from the end was really relentless Sprite, uh, by, uh, Grover that book, that book, that book was really, really good too. So it's just a bunch of things that I couldn't have been doing before the program that I wasn't doing, that, that kind of helped me put the right inputs in and that we are now.Speaker 1 (41:34):Yeah. I think also to harp on the tracking thing. Cause I know, I, I know since I've become more vocal about like what we do in em, and like, of course I'm not going to go into specifics about what we track is like, everybody always wants to ask like specifics about social media or tracking the thing that I always, and I'll just put this out here for people listening and like viewing too. Like, you know, you always, what we do is like again, to very optimized for a specific goal. And like what I see a lot of barbers will look when they tell me, oh, they're tracking this tracking that like it's all over the, there is no, they're just tracking for tracking sake. Right. It's not for a goal. It's like, I don't know, dude, like, let's say, what's a good example of this man.Speaker 1 (42:10):Let's say like, you're trying to like bulk eat, right? Like you're in the gym, you're working out and like, you want to get a diet to bulk, but you're only eating like chocolate cake every day. Right. Technically you're eating a lot. Right. And bulking and like, but it's just not, it's not the right. Foods is not optimized for the right thing. Like you're just going to gain more fat. And it's just like, or maybe you're like, you're counting just calories, calories in calories out. And you're counting calories from like, I don't know, cake, cookies, sodas, all this stuff. It's like cool their calories, but it's not optimized for the goal. And that's why I see a lot of barbers doing incorrectly. Of course, again, to just to be ethical wise, I'm never going to share what we do tracking wise outside of court or social media of course.Speaker 1 (42:44):But it's just like, man, like I don't overthink it. Like don't overthink the thing. Like if anything get help, but don't like the, you could probably do more damage trying to overthink it and trying to guess and trying to like create something like an abstraction of what you have, what your perception is versus like the reality of it. That's and I think like what we've done, like, you know, our NCA tracking sheet and like all these other things, like it's all directed towards one thing and it's like the scale, the push for it. And it's like, you know, it's been, I mean, I've, I think you've seen it too. Like I've iterated these sheets, like to improve them over like even the past year.Speaker 2 (43:20):No, definitely. Um, I think you, uh, like you definitely are in the right path and like building, building up his barbers for sure. Just because, I mean, I'm one of them and it's a great thing, honestly. Like when I, when I, when I, when I get I'll cause ever since you actually shouted me out on Instagram, Barbara has been the enemy back and forth asking me like the same things. But with Jake, Betty has sent you it's. It's like, no dude hit him up, set up interview, like talk to him and see how it goes. Like, it's that simple? Don't overthink it. You know? And a lot of, especially around my area,Speaker 1 (43:54):A lot of people don't understand, like, do I'm not going to, like, I only accept like maybe 20% of people even book a call in the first place. And that's if like, I accept the call. So it's like, dude, you're like, even if you're thinking about it, you should at least like book a call and like, I'll let you know all like, cause I don't want to bring in anybody that I can't help or I can't scale. Like I want to make sure they get results. And I think a lot of people, I think, I think that's just like a repercussion of like, look, there's a lot of people who do bad things in like online, like who run ads and do all this stuff. So I get it right. It's it's like very, it's not a, it's not a healthy space. It's not a space that has like a good repertoire. And I look, I'm just focused again too. If they're, if they're in and they, they they're ready to take action. Great. We'll get you up. But if not like, look, that's probably says more about them than it does myself. And I've learned that I'm like, look my, like at the end of the day, my, uh, I mean, you guys know like, I'll spend like five hours on a Q and a call, like go into like 11,Speaker 2 (44:47):11:00 PM.Speaker 1 (44:49):I'll be like dead tired, but I'm like, it. We just got to get these questions, build this business for them, answer anything. Um, I guess a lot to kind of wrap up, speaking on QA, we had a QA call about an hour. Um, I guess what, what piece of advice would you give somebody who might've been in a similar situation as you prior to EDM or just a younger barber looking at this program, trying to figure things out.Speaker 2 (45:10):Uh, a piece of advice that I would, um, offer is definitely don't overthink it. Don't overthink it. You're going to be fine. If anything is going to help you and it's not going to break, you just do the work honestly. Um, it might, it might seem like, like everyone's against you, but in reality, it's just your pride and ego drop that and you'll be fine.Speaker 1 (45:31):It's like, it's like a, it's like a space rocket, like getting it out there, getting a face turbulence. You're going to have gravity trying to pull you back down and think of that as like all the barbers, like trying to like, oh, what are you doing? Why you can't charge war? It's just like, they, they just never done it. They don't understand the business. And it's just like, look, you know, you have the tools. And also you have like community of like, I don't even know how many bars we have in the program. Like 1 75, maybe closer to 200 right now. It's crazy. Yeah. Um, that like, you know, support you and you can always like reach out to and get help from. Um, that's what I think is like really dope to like that we would build an actual community of like barbers, like I've.Speaker 1 (46:02):Cause I see like everybody it's funny. I just a little off tangent. Somebody sent me a DM. Like it was like last week he was like, why do all your barbers like that? You, you shout out, they don't follow you. And he was like, trying to get out, like something like, oh, you did something wrong. And then they, you don't, they don't follow you. I'm like, dude, I could give a if they don't follow me, like there's a lot. Like I work with them personally. Like we're all great friends. And like, I could give a about a follow thing. Right. It's more about like, look, um, it's just their focal point. Um, but you know, like I see the, you know, everybody kind of follows each other and like interacts and like I know people, like you say, you talked to Luna. I didn't even know that like there's things like friendships and communications that go on that I don't even know about things really dope.Speaker 2 (46:43):Like it's crazy. Like I've met people from the PR just some promo alone from the other side of the fricking continent. Like Greg, for example, he's from Philadelphia Luna. He's from Chicago. Um, uh, I, uh, especially of course people from my Batman backyard, like many, many, many, many fresh I'm talking about him. I talked to him a lot, Eric, Eric Meza. I talked to him a lot. Um, so it's, it's a bunch of people in that that are going after the same thing. And it's great because we're all going through the same trials and tribulations in a sense. Yeah. I think all the awesome.Speaker 1 (47:24):Yeah. Your, your, your screen froze. I don't know if it got recorded, but I think your screen kind of froze. Um, when you were talking, I was like, oh, no, you're good though. Like, well, we'll see if it records or not. So if it did freeze, my apologies, everybody, but technical difficulties. Um, and other than that, dude, I mean, like we've been on this for like an hour so far. It's like 47 minutes. I'll let you go. Cause then I also got to get ready for the Q and a call. I just want to say thank you. Thank you. Thank you for the interview dude. Like I know you're busy. Um, and look, let's not take a year to like get up again. Like I definitely want to make sure you're at 75. Let's get you up to a hundred real quick. Um, oh, heck yeah. Cause I'm super excited to see your growth dude. And honestly like just, just your work ethic. Like, um, you're probably one of the harder working dudes in the program that could be your downfall sometimes. Cause like sometimes you just do you redundantly do the same stuff and not iterate, but like I, I fully believe like, dude, you you'll be at like 1 50, 200, no time. Just I'm really excited for you. Honestly. I, yes.Speaker 2 (48:16):Um, and again, I appreciate you having me on call one and two. It's great. What you're doing with these barbers, you know, I, every, every now and then beyond the, uh, a slap in the head, you know what I mean? To kind of like snap out of it and it's great. You know, we wouldn't be here today without your man, so it's wonderful.Speaker 1 (48:33):Thank you. I always love playing whack-a-mole with you guys. All right, brother. Other than that, I'll see you on the QA call. OfSpeaker 2 (48:40):CourseSpeaker 3 (48:48):[inaudible].